Self-interest February 2011

self-interest@lists.selflanguage.org

16 participants
19 discussions

Please help with SELF installation
by Prescilla 13 Apr '11

13 Apr '11

Hello there. My name is Ms. Prescilla and I am writing to ask for help with SELF installation. I have been searching the web for days now trying to find help with the installation but to no avail. I have not used SELF before and I need to try it now because I am required (school project) to write an interpreter for it. I am currently using Ubuntu 9.10. I have downloaded the self VM and snapshot installers from this link: http://selflanguage.org/download/index.html I have downloaded Self-4.4.tar.gz and Demo.snap. When I extracted the Self-4.4.tar.gz, I got a folder with 4 files in it: ._INSTALL, .INSTALL, .SELF and ._SELF. I tried to open/run all 4 but nothing happened. I have no idea what I'm doing wrong. Maybe I am missing something. Please if anyone can help me, please please send me a message. I would really really appreciate it. Thank you and have a nice day. God Bless. Prescilla -- View this message in context: http://forum.selflanguage.org/Please-help-with-SELF-installation-tp6007342p… Sent from the Self mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

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What does @ mean in Self?
by Duke Normandin 24 Feb '11

24 Feb '11

>From the Tutorial: 23.1 @ 40.4 "send @ to 23.1 with arg 40.4" I cannot seem to find a definition of what the @ symbol means in Self. -- Duke

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Re: [self-interest] APL class projects (was: Please help with SELF installation)
by Michael Latta 21 Feb '11

21 Feb '11

I agree. The language you use has a huge impact on how you approach a problem. In college we had a course that exposed us to 10 languages for that very point. The programmers that have only used one language are crippled in many ways. Michael On Feb 17, 2011, at 7:03 AM, "Jecel Assumpcao Jr." <jecel(a)merlintec.com> wrote: > I was taking a class once and the teacher proposed a problem where you > had to number the squares in a crossword puzzle. Only squares which were > the start of two or more horizontal or vertical spaces were to be > numbered. > > She called me to the blackboard and told be to start drawing an NS chart > (http://www.hit.ac.il/staff/leonidm/information-systems/ch56.html) and I > said we first had to decide what language the program would be written > in. She claimed that the language you use has no effect on how you think > about the problem, and in this case there would always be three nested > loops. That is not something you should ever say to me :-) I told her > that if I used APL there would be no loops. So she said the language > would be Pascal and I finished the program for her. > > The following class I have her the APL version as a present. I could > have written it in one line, but did it in four instead to make it more > readable :-) > > -- Jecel > > David Harris wrote on Wed, 16 Feb 2011 21:37:37 -0800 >> >> I did LU decomposition and backward substitution in two lines of APL. >> Oh, and TicTacToe in two lines as well, as I recall. Of course they weren't >> terribly understandable :-) That was back when we had a IBM370/145 >> with APL microcode, and Selectric terminals --- ah, the good ol' days. >> David >> >> On Wed, Feb 16, 2011 at 4:16 PM, Michael Latta wrote: >> >> I did a full z80 simulator and console in APL in 11 pages of loosely >> formatted code. For some tasks it is very effective. >> >> Michael >> On Feb 16, 2011, at 5:00 PM, Casey Ransberger wrote: >> >> I think I saw a talk on YouTube where someone aced a project that >> way. Used APL too if I remember right. Think they guy's name was >> David something or other? >> >> On Feb 9, 2011, at 3:35 PM, ungar wrote: >> >> >> >> Can't help you too much, but if you want to be clever, write it in a >> dynamic language like APL or Smalltalk! (Or Lisp...) >> - David > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > >

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Swap mouse buttons? Key bindings?
by Casey Ransberger 20 Feb '11

20 Feb '11

Is there an way to switch out the default mouse button bindings? The default really messes me up for some reason. It'd also be really a lot nicer to be able to configure my arrow key chords to do what my hands are used to. Any pointers on where to look for such behavior? I realize this is probably something that most folks just deal with, but after experiencing native editing behavior in Cuis it's hard to want to go back to having to reach all the way over to my function key in order to move to the beginning of the line.

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Selecting more than 1 Submorphs?
by Duke Normandin 18 Feb '11

18 Feb '11

How do I go about selecting more than one labelMorph from the Submorphs menu? The Submorph contains numerous lines of text. I want to select them all, and change some of their common properties - like the font type and font color. -- Duke

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Re: [self-interest] Questions about implied self
by Casey Ransberger 17 Feb '11

17 Feb '11

I'm having some trouble wanting the feature. When I look at the former, I don't "see" the grouping in my minds eye. Maybe I'll get used to it, but it sure seems easy to get wrong. Maybe the feature wants some syntax highlighting or something:) On Feb 17, 2011, at 9:47 AM, "Jecel Assumpcao Jr." <jecel(a)merlintec.com> wrote: > Casey, > > > I may be suffering from flatulent gray matter; I read this in the handbook, section 2.3.3: > > > > Associativity. Keyword messages associate from right to left, so > > > > 5 min: 6 min: 7 Max: 8 Max: 9 min: 10 Max: 11 > > > > is interpreted as > > > > 5 min: (6 min: 7 Max: 8 Max: (9 min: 10 Max: 11)) > > You are probably right and it is my memory that is incorrect. I thought > that something like "5 min: 6 min: 7" would be considered a syntax error > and you would be forced to add parenthesis to get it to parse (another > small Self/Smalltalk-80 difference: what is called the compiler in > Smalltalk-80 is known as the parser in Self so that the term compiler > can be used for the bytecode-to-machine code translator). > > Looking at my 1993 tinySelf 0 code, I see that it would indeed parse the > above as "5 min: (6 min: 7)" without any errors. So at one time I knew > this :-) > > Sorry about the confusion, > -- Jecel > >

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Re: [self-interest] Questions about implied self
by Casey Ransberger 17 Feb '11

17 Feb '11

Yeah, but I was so much older then. I'm younger than that now:) On Feb 17, 2011, at 9:47 AM, "Jecel Assumpcao Jr." <jecel(a)merlintec.com> wrote: > Casey, > > > I may be suffering from flatulent gray matter; I read this in the handbook, section 2.3.3: > > > > Associativity. Keyword messages associate from right to left, so > > > > 5 min: 6 min: 7 Max: 8 Max: 9 min: 10 Max: 11 > > > > is interpreted as > > > > 5 min: (6 min: 7 Max: 8 Max: (9 min: 10 Max: 11)) > > You are probably right and it is my memory that is incorrect. I thought > that something like "5 min: 6 min: 7" would be considered a syntax error > and you would be forced to add parenthesis to get it to parse (another > small Self/Smalltalk-80 difference: what is called the compiler in > Smalltalk-80 is known as the parser in Self so that the term compiler > can be used for the bytecode-to-machine code translator). > > Looking at my 1993 tinySelf 0 code, I see that it would indeed parse the > above as "5 min: (6 min: 7)" without any errors. So at one time I knew > this :-) > > Sorry about the confusion, > -- Jecel > >

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Re: [self-interest] Questions about implied self
by Casey Ransberger 17 Feb '11

17 Feb '11

On Feb 17, 2011, at 9:10 AM, "Jecel Assumpcao Jr." <jecel(a)merlintec.com> wrote: > Casey, > > > So keyword messages eval right to left such than one needs to type > > less parens? I think this might explain why I've been having trouble > > typing in expressions that parse; I was under the impression that the > > capitalization trick took care of that, so, thinko there on my part. > > Where did you get the right to left thing from? Only binary selectors > with exactly the same name have an evaluation order in Self and > everything else needs parenthesis. Capitalization eliminates some > parenthesis (what would be the most inconvenient ones due to the lack of > an assignment operator) from nested keyword expressions. > I may be suffering from flatulent gray matter; I read this in the handbook, section 2.3.3: Associativity. Keyword messages associate from right to left, so 5 min: 6 min: 7 Max: 8 Max: 9 min: 10 Max: 11 is interpreted as 5 min: (6 min: 7 Max: 8 Max: (9 min: 10 Max: 11))

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Self on 64 bit Linux
by Chris Double 17 Feb '11

17 Feb '11

I get build errors when compiling Self on a 64 bit linux system. Any tips on getting this working? Even doing a 32-bit build would be fine. Chris. -- http://www.bluishcoder.co.nz

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Questions about implied self
by Casey Ransberger 17 Feb '11

17 Feb '11

I'm feeling a bit cross-eyed. Please have mercy if any of these questions are particularly uninformed. So keyword messages eval right to left such than one needs to type less parens? I think this might explain why I've been having trouble typing in expressions that parse; I was under the impression that the capitalization trick took care of that, so, thinko there on my part. Questions... while I'm getting used to that, can I type the parens and then organize the message chain with the keyword parts left to right like I'm used to? Is the capitalization trick a syntactic req'ment in every case, or only in the case of disambiguating statements that suffer ambiguity resulting from the implied self? If I were to use an explicit self, does Smalltalk message syntax work in most cases? Is there a semantic difference between the implied self and the explicit self? I haven't encountered a "cascade message" yet; do these exist in Self? Does the cascade syntax stop being useful when the receiver is usually self and self is usually implied? I'm having a complete ball exploring Self. The object model is stunningly beautiful, and the Outliner is about the most refreshing thing I've seen in UI since discovering the halos in Squeak.

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Self-interest February 2011