Self-interest October 1996

self-interest@lists.selflanguage.org

12 participants
11 discussions

Building the VM source
by Jon Howell 30 Oct '96

30 Oct '96

Hi there again. I've played with Self via a remote X connection (thanks, Mario!), and I love it. I'm buying a Sparc to run it on. (slowly. :v) I would like to build the VM source. (Hinting to maybe considering porting it to something else, though I understand from reading back through the archive of this list that this would be a formidable undertaking. So I best not make any promises. :v) However, it's abundantly not clear to me how to get the source to build on a SunOS machine. The docs mention some RCS setup from UW, but (of course) the source tree isn't set up that way. I spent a fair amount of time just getting the compile-time tools in bin/sun4 to build. This makes me think that there's probably a "right way" to get the tree to build (a "make all" sort of thing), and I don't have it. :v) Any tips would be greatly appreciated. Thanks, --Jon Jon Howell jonh(a)cs.dartmouth.edu 603-643-2460 (h) 603-646-3297 (w) http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~jonh

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Re: Self papers PS->HTML
by guy＠criss.fr 24 Oct '96

24 Oct '96

According to what you said: > Over the summer, we had an intern, Alex Jacoby, look at producing HTML > from the original FrameMaker docs using WebWorks Publisher. the documentation you intend to translate into HTML pages has been produced using Framemaker. Do you know about Webmaker, developed by CERN people at Geneva? It translates directly Framemaker documents into HTML pages. It is easy to understand, well documented and easy to use. Last year, when I got it through the Web it was free of charge. I don't remember exactly from which Url I unloaded it, buy I found it with Yahoo using the "Webmaker" index. It is worth to be tried. Good luck! Guy Tassart

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Unprintable Postscript files
by Sieto Idema 23 Oct '96

23 Oct '96

Hi there, I'm trying to print the postscript manuals, but the only message that comes out of the printer is 'Can't select requested paper size for Frame print job!'. It seems that my printer doesn't understand the paper size, and I can't change that! Is there anybody who can fix it? It's very boring to read the manuals from screen. Thanks in advance. Koen Zwikstra

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No wonder why nobody posts to this list
by Steve Dekorte 20 Oct '96

20 Oct '96

Someone needs to fix this mailing list. I got a ton of returned mail after I sent my last message to self-interest(a)self.smli.com. See below: --- Date: Fri, 18 Oct 96 18:03:03 EDT From: Network Mailer <VMMAIL(a)pucc.PRINCETON.EDU> To: <@pucc.PRINCETON.EDU:dekorte@suite.suite.com> Subject: mail delivery error Batch SMTP transaction log follows: 220 PUCC.PRINCETON.EDU Columbia MAILER R2.10 ptf008 BSMTP service ready. 050 HELO PUCC 250 PUCC.PRINCETON.EDU Hello PUCC 050 MAIL FROM:<@pucc.PRINCETON.EDU:dekorte@suite.suite.com> 250 <@pucc.PRINCETON.EDU:dekorte@suite.suite.com>... sender OK. 050 RCPT TO:<UDIS2(a)CSEARN.BITNET> 250 <UDIS2(a)CSEARN.BITNET>... recipient OK. 050 DATA 354 Start mail input. End with <crlf>.<crlf> 554-Mail not delivered to some or all recipients: 554 Unknown host: CSEARN ... 050 QUIT 221 PUCC.PRINCETON.EDU Columbia MAILER BSMTP service done. Original message follows: ... --- Date: Fri, 18 Oct 1996 15:11:59 -0700 From: Mailer-Daemon(a)self.sunlabs.com (Mail Delivery Subsystem) Subject: Returned mail: Host unknown (Name server: lpf.org: host not found) To: <dekorte(a)suite.suite.com> The original message was received at Fri, 18 Oct 1996 13:33:00 -0700 from bilbo.suite.com [149.56.175.1] ----- The following addresses had delivery problems ----- mre(a)lpf.org (unrecoverable error) (expanded from: s-i-15) ----- Transcript of session follows ----- vargaz(a)ludens.elte.hu... Deferred: Connection refused by ludens.elte.hu. 451 nehal(a)cimco.com... timeout waiting for input during client greeting 451 nehal(a)cimco.com... reply: read error from uu6.psi.com. 550 mre(a)lpf.org... Host unknown (Name server: lpf.org: host not found) ... while talking to lsi.usp.br.: >>> MAIL From:<dekorte(a)suite.suite.com> <<< 421 Cannot bind to map mail.aliases in domain lsi.usp.br: no such map in server's domain: Bad file number jecel(a)lsi.usp.br... Deferred: 421 Cannot bind to map mail.aliases in domain lsi.usp.br: no such map in server's domain: Bad file number ichiki(a)mt.cs.keio.ac.jp... Deferred: Connection timed out during initial connection with kogwy.cc.keio.ac.jp. clp(a)home.HarvardSq.com... Deferred: Connection timed out during initial connection with home.harvardsq.com ----- Original message follows ----- ... --- Date: Fri, 18 Oct 1996 18:02:19 -0400 Reply-To: Postmaster(a)UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu From: RFC822 mailer (LMail release 1.2a/1.8a) <MAILER(a)UBVM.cc.buffalo.edu> Subject: Undelivered mail To: dekorte(a)SUITE.suite.com X-Report-Type: Nondelivery; boundary="> Error description:" An error was detected while processing the enclosed message. A list of the affected recipients follows. This list is in a special format that allows software like LISTSERV to automatically take action on incorrect addresses; you can safely ignore the numeric codes. --> Error description: Error-For: al(a)BRUSPSCE.BITNET Error-Code: 1 Error-Text: Node BRUSPSCE is unknown as of VERS9610. Error-End: One error reported. ------------------------- Rejected message (27 lines) ------------------------- ... ---- Date: Fri, 18 Oct 1996 17:37:44 -0400 (EDT) From: Mail Delivery Subsystem <MAILER-DAEMON(a)gte.com> Subject: Returned mail: User unknown To: <dekorte(a)suite.suite.com> Auto-Submitted: auto-generated (failure) The original message was received at Fri, 18 Oct 1996 17:37:42 -0400 (EDT) from postman@localhost ----- The following addresses have delivery notifications ----- <fm02(a)gte.com> (unrecoverable error) ----- Transcript of session follows ----- ... --- Date: Fri, 18 Oct 1996 23:35:34 +0200 From: Mail Delivery Subsystem <MAILER-DAEMON(a)damek.kth.se> Subject: Returned mail: Host unknown (Name server: t.hfb.se: no data known) To: <dekorte(a)suite.suite.com> The original message was received at Fri, 18 Oct 1996 23:35:23 +0200 from self.sunlabs.com [204.153.12.36] ----- The following addresses had delivery problems ----- jbr(a)t.hfb.se (unrecoverable error) (expanded from: <ellus(a)damek.kth.se>) ----- Transcript of session follows ----- 501 jbr(a)t.hfb.se... 550 Host unknown (Name server: t.hfb.se: no data known) ----- Original message follows ----- ... --- Date: Fri, 18 Oct 96 17:11:40 EDT From: Mailer-Daemon(a)swarm.lehman.com (Mail Delivery Subsystem) Subject: Returned mail: Service unavailable To: <dekorte(a)suite.suite.com> ----- Transcript of session follows ----- mail: can't send to jklepach Mail saved in dead.letter 554 <jklepach(a)swarm.silver2.lehman.com>... Service unavailable ----- Unsent message follows ----- ... ---- Date: Fri, 18 Oct 1996 17:13:55 -0400 (EDT) From: Mail Delivery Subsystem <MAILER-DAEMON(a)voicenet.com> Subject: Returned mail: mail.voicenet.com. config error: mail loops back to me (MX problem?) To: <dekorte(a)suite.suite.com> Auto-Submitted: auto-generated (failure) The original message was received at Fri, 18 Oct 1996 17:13:30 -0400 (EDT) from self.sunlabs.com [204.153.12.36] ----- Transcript of session follows ----- ... --- Date: Fri, 18 Oct 1996 19:13:12 -0300 From: Mail Delivery Subsystem <MAILER-DAEMON(a)net.usp.br> Subject: Returned mail: Host unknown (Name server: mail.iss.lcca.usp.br.: no data known) To: <dekorte(a)suite.suite.com> The original message was received at Fri, 18 Oct 1996 19:13:11 -0300 from cat.cce.usp.br [143.107.70.2] ----- The following addresses had delivery problems ----- <knishimo(a)usp.br> (unrecoverable error) ----- Transcript of session follows ----- 550 <knishimo(a)usp.br>... Host unknown (Name server: mail.iss.lcca.usp.br.: no data known) ----- Original message follows ----- ...

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Would love to run Self, but...
by Jon Howell 18 Oct '96

18 Oct '96

Hi there. So I've been working hard to find a Sun on my campus that I can run Self on. Unfortunately, the only thing I've come up with is an IPX, I think, maybe a Classic -- haven't seen the box. uname -a gives: "SunOS katahdin 4.1.2 1 sun4c". It has a meager 16M of RAM. (Yes, I know it'll be unbearable even if I can get it to start.) But when I unpack it and type "Snapshot" as per the directions, I get: ld.so: warning: /usr/lib/libc.so.1.7 has older revision than expected 9 Segmentation fault Self is in my path, and DISPLAY points to my X terminal. I borrowed a libc.so.1.8, and put it in my LD_LIBRARY_PATH, but got the same warning. I tried looking at the core (moved core/ so it could write one :v), but there are no symbols in Self. Can anyone give me a pointer as to what might be wrong? Thanks much, --Jon Jon Howell jonh(a)cs.dartmouth.edu 603-643-2460 (h) 603-646-3297 (w) http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~jonh

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Re: Self + Java - what status is ?
by randall.smith＠Eng.Sun.COM 15 Oct '96

15 Oct '96

Okay everyone!! Wait a minute already! Many of you are asking to try this browser-based view of Self. When we tried it with a large group (eight or ten) at Sun the performance was pretty bad...but it was a summer student project! Many of us could not even connect, and that was from within Sun's network. It also appears Java performance in many browsers is poor. However! Since there is so much interest, I MAY try to put out some properly equipped image and a URL to which you can attach...when I get a chance, which won't be this week! So I'll let you all know, thanks for your interest... --Randy > From jonh(a)cs.dartmouth.edu Mon Oct 14 18:15:28 1996 > Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 21:15:14 -0400 (EDT) > From: Jon Howell <jonh(a)cs.dartmouth.edu> > To: self-interest(a)self.sunlabs.com, randall.smith@Eng > Subject: Re: Self + Java - what status is ? > MIME-Version: 1.0 > > Randy said: > > Java objects that draw just like Self's "morphs" are downloaded through > > the socket into the client's browser. Users mouse and keyboard input as > > well as their navigational moves are also sent into the world so > > they can be reflected for all to see. > > > > Cool, eh? > "Cool, eh?" And no URL!? I could faint. :v) Is this thing still up for > the viewing? I've just rapidly consumed about five Self papers, and I'm > dying (well...) to try it, but I have no access to any modern Suns. (yes, > only one isn't a 680x0. :vP ) The "try it over X" link to me.sun.com > doesn't work (and if it did, it would probably be a drag :v), so your > report of a Java-accessible Self has me all curious. > > --Jon > > Jon Howell > jonh(a)cs.dartmouth.edu > 603-643-2460 (h) 603-646-3297 (w) > http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~jonh > >

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Re: Self + Java - what status is ?
by Jon Howell 15 Oct '96

15 Oct '96

Randy said: > Java objects that draw just like Self's "morphs" are downloaded through > the socket into the client's browser. Users mouse and keyboard input as > well as their navigational moves are also sent into the world so > they can be reflected for all to see. > > Cool, eh? "Cool, eh?" And no URL!? I could faint. :v) Is this thing still up for the viewing? I've just rapidly consumed about five Self papers, and I'm dying (well...) to try it, but I have no access to any modern Suns. (yes, only one isn't a 680x0. :vP ) The "try it over X" link to me.sun.com doesn't work (and if it did, it would probably be a drag :v), so your report of a Java-accessible Self has me all curious. --Jon Jon Howell jonh(a)cs.dartmouth.edu 603-643-2460 (h) 603-646-3297 (w) http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~jonh

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Re: Self + Java - what status is ?
by randall.smith＠Eng.Sun.COM 14 Oct '96

14 Oct '96

There was a summer student project that made a viewer into the Self world (now called "Kansas") You just type the URL into the browser, and *zang!* -- there you are in Kansas. It is of course a multi-user shared space, and you can see the other cursors out there, or the edges of their screen as users pan across the space. Self (Kansas) is running on a central machine with a socket waiting for connections. The clients have browsers out there on the web somewhere, and they load an applet that connects to the socket. Java objects that draw just like Self's "morphs" are downloaded through the socket into the client's browser. Users mouse and keyboard input as well as their navigational moves are also sent into the world so they can be reflected for all to see. Cool, eh? --Randy > From tandr(a)ptc.com Mon Oct 14 07:19:50 1996 > Sender: tandr(a)ptc.com > Date: Mon, 14 Oct 1996 16:09:11 +0300 > From: Andrei Tcherepanov <tandr(a)ptc.com> > Organization: Parametric Technology Corp. (Israel) > X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (X11; I; SunOS 5.4 sun4m) > Mime-Version: 1.0 > To: self-interest(a)self.sunlabs.com > Subject: Self + Java - what status is ? > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > Hi! > > Some times ago Mario Wolczko wrote about > "project this summer involving Self and Java"... > > Middle of autumn ... > > What Is status ( what's happend ), > or it is "Top Secret" ? > > > Thanks, > Andrei ( tandr(a)ptc.com ) >

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Self code
by Arazik Khachatrian 14 Oct '96

14 Oct '96

I would appreciate,if someone send me examples of Self code. I have difficulties in understanding Self syntax. Thank you. Araz Khachatrian

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Self + Java - what status is ?
by Andrei Tcherepanov 14 Oct '96

14 Oct '96

Hi! Some times ago Mario Wolczko wrote about "project this summer involving Self and Java"... Middle of autumn ... What Is status ( what's happend ), or it is "Top Secret" ? Thanks, Andrei ( tandr(a)ptc.com )

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Self-interest October 1996