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On 09/17/2014 05:15 AM, Russell Allen <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:mail@russell-allen.com">mail@russell-allen.com</a>
[self-interest] wrote:
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<div>On 16 Sep 2014, at 9:39 pm, Casey Ransberger <a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:casey.obrien.r@gmail.com">casey.obrien.r@gmail.com</a>
[self-interest] <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:self-interest@yahoogroups.com">self-interest@yahoogroups.com</a>>
wrote:</div>
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<div style="margin: 0px 0px 1em;"><span>On Sep 16, 2014, at 2:34
AM, "Russell Allen</span> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:mail@russell-allen.com">mail@russell-allen.com</a> <span>[self-interest]"
<</span><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:self-interest@yahoogroups.com">self-interest@yahoogroups.com</a><span>>
wrote:</span></div>
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<div>On 16 Sep 2014, at 5:17 pm, Casey Ransberger<span
class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:casey.obrien.r@gmail.com">casey.obrien.r@gmail.com</a><span
class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>[self-interest] <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:self-interest@yahoogroups.com">self-interest@yahoogroups.com</a>>
wrote:</div>
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<div style="margin: 0px 0px 1em;"><span>Web development
framework. Okay, so that isn't really fun at all, but it *might* create
some new interest in the project.</span></div>
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<div>We now have an almost web server, which I'm running<span
class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://selflangauge.org/">selflangauge.org</a><span
class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>on behind nginx</div>
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<div>For the simple sites I've written most web frameworks seem
weirdly complex to me, but it's not my area so I assume they are useful
for people who need them.</div>
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Awesome. Can I read the code somewhere?</div>
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<div>I've split it out into <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://github.com/russellallen/self-webserver">http://github.com/russellallen/self-webserver</a></div>
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<div>It's more a sketch of a webserver than something real :)</div>
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<div><span>Mother of Stupid Ideas: do a web browser and fire
90% of the operating system, which is nowadays a life support system
for a web browser anyway. I've been wanting to do this in Squeak since
I arrived unwashed at the threshold of the mysteries of the message
send. In Self, though, one of the ideas I had could really work better
than in any other system presently: one could use direct, live
manipulation of the morphs that comprise a web page to edit the actual
page in a WYSIWYG fashion, and then use a variant of the object
transporter, maybe with some parsing expression grammar sauce, to idea
send a message which makes the page recursively render itself as HTML,
CSS, and Javascript. It's like FrontPage, but without all of the suck!
Of course, we'd need recruits, so...</span></div>
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<div>Oh that's easy. Write a javascript->self translator, run
webkit through emscripten and Bob's your uncle :p</div>
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<div>Haha, but that defeats the entire point. The browser must be
written in Self. That's how I get to fire my operating system. It could
be Self, it could be Squeak, but if we ever built a web browser, we
could seriously run on nearly bare metal and get by. It's an enormous
amount of work to support a broken paradigm though, so I'm not
oblivious to why it hasn't happened yet. </div>
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<div>You could easily have a Linux kernel boot into Self (with or
without a really cut down userland)</div>
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<div>Big problems for me are:</div>
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<div>(1) only 32 bit. So either we write a new 64 bit VM, or we run
lots of Self vms messaging each other</div>
<div>(2) complete lack of security within a Self world. ie code can
do abominations like "0 _Quit" <br>
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why "0 _Quit" and not just "_Quit"?<br>
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Gordon<br>
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<div>Russell</div>
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