<html><head></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div>I put annotations in to support the other world; not the world at execution-time, but the world at programming time.</div><div>I have yet to see a model of execution that supports all of the structure a programmer needs to impose upon the world.</div><div>For instance, if you are going to file out a subset of objects or slots and then file them in to another world of objects, I am convinced</div><div>that you need more information than just what is needed to run the objects. See my OOPSLA transporter paper for details.</div><div><br></div><div>Also, it is very useful to have categories within a single object. At run-time you need just one object, but at concept-time, you need</div><div>some way to group things, although a strict hierarchy may not be optimal.</div><div><br></div><div>So, if you need some information that plays no role in execution, it must only exist in the reflective domain.</div><div>I don't see how you get anything much different than annotations, but I would enjoy seeing proposals.</div><div><br></div><div>Copy-down is a bit of a different matter. It sort of straddles programming time and run time, though only REFLECTIVE run-time.</div><div>Maybe the folks at Vrije have a better way, or maybe Ly, my latest object system design is better. (I think so.)</div><div>In Ly, all non-constant slots are copied-down, as part of the language.</div><div><br></div><div>It's easy to complain about something, but think about why it's there and how else you would do it.</div><div>In my experience, one ends up sweeping dirt around under the carpet; it doesn't go away. </div><div>Once in a while there is a nice unification. If you don't like annotations, let's see you find that unification.</div><div><br></div><div>- David</div><div><br></div><br><div><div>On Dec 25, 2010, at 10:39 PM, Josh Flowers wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite">
<div style="background-color: #fff;">
<span style="display:none"> </span>
<div id="ygrp-text"><p>Not sure I'd have been quite so diplomatic about it - but I don't disagree.<br>
<br>
> First of all I wish you all the best :D.<br>
> <br>
> I hate annotation.<br>
> They are like a language in a language.<br>
> Why not create invisible slots or something that are simply hidden my the outliner.<br>
> C'mon they managed to do the fricking namespaces with objects and slots... why then staple something on top later.<br>
> This has kept me up all week, what a relief.<br>
> <br>
> Happy Holidays, Jan<br>
> <br>
> <br>
> ------------------------------------<br>
> <br>
> Yahoo! Groups Links<br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
<br>
</p>
</div>
</div>
<!-- end group email -->
</blockquote></div><br></body></html>