[self-interest] Quiet in Self land?

Russell Allen mail at russell-allen.com
Wed Sep 17 03:15:17 UTC 2014

On 16 Sep 2014, at 9:39 pm, Casey Ransberger casey.obrien.r at gmail.com [self-interest] <self-interest at yahoogroups.com> wrote:
> On Sep 16, 2014, at 2:34 AM, "Russell Allen mail at russell-allen.com [self-interest]" <self-interest at yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>> On 16 Sep 2014, at 5:17 pm, Casey Ransberger casey.obrien.r at gmail.com [self-interest] <self-interest at yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>>> Web development framework. Okay, so that isn't really fun at all, but it *might* create some new interest in the project.
>> We now have an almost web server, which I'm running selflangauge.org on behind nginx
>> For the simple sites I've written most web frameworks seem weirdly complex to me, but it's not my area so I assume they are useful for people who need them.
> Awesome. Can I read the code somewhere?

I've split it out into http://github.com/russellallen/self-webserver

It's more a sketch of a webserver than something real :)

>>> Mother of Stupid Ideas: do a web browser and fire 90% of the operating system, which is nowadays a life support system for a web browser anyway. I've been wanting to do this in Squeak since I arrived unwashed at the threshold of the mysteries of the message send. In Self, though, one of the ideas I had could really work better than in any other system presently: one could use direct, live manipulation of the morphs that comprise a web page to edit the actual page in a WYSIWYG fashion, and then use a variant of the object transporter, maybe with some parsing expression grammar sauce, to idea send a message which makes the page recursively render itself as HTML, CSS, and Javascript. It's like FrontPage, but without all of the suck! Of course, we'd need recruits, so...
>> Oh that's easy. Write a javascript->self translator, run webkit through emscripten and Bob's your uncle :p
> Haha, but that defeats the entire point. The browser must be written in Self. That's how I get to fire my operating system. It could be Self, it could be Squeak, but if we ever built a web browser, we could seriously run on nearly bare metal and get by. It's an enormous amount of work to support a broken paradigm though, so I'm not oblivious to why it hasn't happened yet. 

You could easily have a Linux kernel boot into Self (with or without a really cut down userland)

Big problems for me are:

(1) only 32 bit. So either we write a new 64 bit VM, or we run lots of Self vms messaging each other
(2) complete lack of security within a Self world. ie code can do abominations like "0 _Quit" 

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