Following the advice Reinald Silveira gave me earlier this year, I have downloaded the Doxygen program which can read the sources for an applications and generate some documentation for it in several formats. You can see the html results here:
http://www.merlintec.com/selfvmdoc/
Since my link is very slow, you can probably get better results by downloading Doxygen yourself (there is a link on this page) and running it on the sources to get a local copy of this.
I hope this can help people to understand how the virtual machine works a little better. Is anybody still thinking about porting Self 4.1.2 to the PC? After thinking very hard about this I decided that it would be better for me to continue with my self-in-self effort instead.
BTW, I will be giving a 12 hour course on Self to students of the Federal University of São Carlos. It will be an official extension course with certificates and all. Luckily they have an aging Sparc or two (mostly black and white X terminals which Self doesn't like, though), but it is a shame we can't use their abundant PCs.
-- Jecel
Jecel Assumpcao Jr wrote:
BTW, I will be giving a 12 hour course on Self to students of the Federal University of São Carlos. It will be an official extension course with certificates and all. Luckily they have an aging Sparc or two (mostly black and white X terminals which Self doesn't like, though), but it is a shame we can't use their abundant PCs.
Cool! Where can I have more info? (Dates, etc.) Particularly, what's the most cost-effective way to get from Rio de Janeiro to São Carlos?
Looks like I'll finally be able to see some of the Self community firsthand, being a continent away from all other Self gatherings I've heard of so far. :)
Rafael Kaufmann wrote:
Cool! Where can I have more info? (Dates, etc.) Particularly, what's the most cost-effective way to get from Rio de Janeiro to São Carlos?
You can always walk ;-) But a bus isn't too expensive either. I think that this course will only be available to the students of UFSCAR, but you can be sure that I will organize others very soon which will be more open.
Looks like I'll finally be able to see some of the Self community firsthand, being a continent away from all other Self gatherings I've heard of so far. :)
Between me, the people at São Paulo and the JSelf guys (Argentina) it seems that there are currently more Selfish people in South America than any other place. I am counting on the Germans and Americans to prove me wrong :-)
A Self gathering would be a very good idea. There is an interesting event around here called Oktobertech (guess when? :-) and it might be nice to organize a Self session.
-- Jecel
This is *way* cool!
Rock on, South Americans!
- Dave
At 6:37 PM -0300 6/29/00, Jecel Assumpcao Jr wrote:
Rafael Kaufmann wrote:
Cool! Where can I have more info? (Dates, etc.) Particularly, what's the most cost-effective way to get from Rio de Janeiro to São Carlos?
You can always walk ;-) But a bus isn't too expensive either. I think that this course will only be available to the students of UFSCAR, but you can be sure that I will organize others very soon which will be more open.
Looks like I'll finally be able to see some of the Self community firsthand, being a continent away from all other Self gatherings I've heard of so far. :)
Between me, the people at São Paulo and the JSelf guys (Argentina) it seems that there are currently more Selfish people in South America than any other place. I am counting on the Germans and Americans to prove me wrong :-)
A Self gathering would be a very good idea. There is an interesting event around here called Oktobertech (guess when? :-) and it might be nice to organize a Self session.
-- Jecel
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Jecel Assumpcao Jr wrote:
Luckily they have an aging Sparc or two (mostly black and white X terminals which Self doesn't like, though), but it is a shame we can't use their abundant PCs.
The PCs could run an XWindows server, this way you can have a color view (of Self running on the sparcs) on the PCs.
Another (free) option could be VNC. VNC is relatively popular so if you are lucky it's client might allready be installed on the PCs http://www.uk.research.att.com/vnc/
Reinout Heeck ------------- reinz@desk.org
On Thu, 29 Jun 2000, Reinout Heeck wrote:
The PCs could run an XWindows server, this way you can have a color view (of Self running on the sparcs) on the PCs.
Another (free) option could be VNC. VNC is relatively popular so if you are lucky it's client might allready be installed on the PCs
VNC is lighter than X, but I would have to run multiple versions of the server in the same machine as Self (if I were to run them on the user's PCs, I might as well just run X directly) and that might slow things down.
I considered creating a vncCanvas object a while back. That would allow the VNC clients to connect directly to Self and would be more efficient (and would work for the Mac version of Self as well).
Anyway, thanks for the tip. I'll test VNC to see how it performs.
One idea that I have been studying lately is using MPEG-4 as the imaging model for Self. This would allow us to have remote viewers like we do with X Windows now but would perform better with complex graphics. Is anybody interested in this?
-- Jecel
[okay - I'm only just getting to this - I'm a single dad working at an internet startup - I'm busy :-]
Jecel Assumpcao Jr wrote:
On Thu, 29 Jun 2000, Reinout Heeck wrote:
The PCs could run an XWindows server, this way you can have a color view (of Self running on the sparcs) on the PCs.
[....]
One idea that I have been studying lately is using MPEG-4 as the imaging model for Self. This would allow us to have remote viewers like we do with X Windows now but would perform better with complex graphics. Is anybody interested in this?
How about a Quartz-like canvas? I.e., PDF. The MacOSX UI of Self would be very pretty :-)
It supports links (i.e., callbacks), is completely resolution-independent, enables a lot of kewl FX, and screenshots would be cake :-)
Or perhaps SWF would be better. SWF is the format used for Flash files, and maybe 80-90% of web browsers have the Flash plug-in - so the Self World could show up anywhere! Though, come to think of it, most people have Adobe Acrobat, too.
While MPEG-4, SWF, and PDF all have some attributes in common (animation, vector drawing, simple interaction), there are of course some trade-offs. SWF and PDF are at least originated by single corporations (Macromedia and Adobe, respectively), though they do claim some amount of openness. MPEG4 is more neutral in that sense, but it is also dramatically less widespread.
Brook
On Fri, 28 Jul 2000, Brook Conner wrote:
[okay - I'm only just getting to this - I'm a single dad working at an internet startup - I'm busy :-]
At the speed these projects get finished, you could wait a few years to comment and it would still be relevant :-(
[MPEG-4 as the imaging model for Self?]
How about a Quartz-like canvas? I.e., PDF. The MacOSX UI of Self would be very pretty :-)
I have always been a big fan of Postscript based interfaces (NeWS, NeXT). But having two languages (Objective-C and Postcript in the NeXTStep case) complicates things.
It supports links (i.e., callbacks), is completely resolution-independent, enables a lot of kewl FX, and screenshots would be cake :-)
Doesn't it have to be licensed from Adobe? In that case it isn't an option for free software.
Or perhaps SWF would be better. SWF is the format used for Flash files, and maybe 80-90% of web browsers have the Flash plug-in - so the Self World could show up anywhere! Though, come to think of it, most people have Adobe Acrobat, too.
Squeak Smalltalk has an implementation of an older version of Flash, so adapting it for Self would be very easy. But they have layered this on top of a lower level imaging model called Balloon 2D and Balloon 3D. Those were created to build a more flexible Morphic interface and so I have studied them as an option for Self as well.
While MPEG-4, SWF, and PDF all have some attributes in common (animation, vector drawing, simple interaction), there are of course some trade-offs. SWF and PDF are at least originated by single corporations (Macromedia and Adobe, respectively), though they do claim some amount of openness. MPEG4 is more neutral in that sense, but it is also dramatically less widespread.
SWF has some limited streaming and mpeg-4 an even better update model. I am familiar with static PDF, but have no idea how it works in a dynamic context. Most of mpeg-4 is implemented in the latest releases of Microsoft's MediaPlayer and I expect it to be very popular within the next two years. It is more interesting to be compatible with the future than the past :-)
Actually, PDF and mpeg-4 are somewhat complementary. Mpeg-4 is good at scene composition and transporting natural images while PDF can handle text and basic graphics much better. Almost anything would be an improvement on X Windows.
-- Jecel
self-interest@lists.selflanguage.org
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Brook Conner -
David Ungar -
Jecel Assumpcao Jr -
Rafael Kaufmann -
Reinout Heeck